Following his paid programming opinions expressed are not necessarily those of this radio station it advertisers or sponsors on the western door to the eastern -- and beyond welcome tool -- talk native was John McCain. John addresses the issues of native people their communities and struggled to maintain distinction and a autonomy. Call 7168031520. To join the discussion now here's your host John McCain. Say hello welcome let's talk native this is John team and I've got to some -- studio I've got them Matt hill back after a couple of weeks later on all. But that's that good a bad back. I've also got Ross John and holly -- in studio. Hi folks thanks for joining me you don't care. And part of what a lot -- talk about today is it was a trip that that Roth and holly with up to -- back from -- back from from Phoenix. We didn't go all down there for the same reasons but -- we need to attend a conference together and with arm that speak yet -- you agree going. And participated at some level there. How you'll already in Phoenix 48 diabetes. Conference -- -- -- Yes I was it was hosted this was the sixteenth annual diabetes prevention conference put on by. The University of Oklahoma and it was held in Phoenix or some. Now is that geared towards towards prevented in Indian Country -- so yes it earned the so you're down there already. And as it turns out I got asked to go down in and speak at at. Arizona State University. The Tempe campus to. To speak about inherent sovereignty as a part of a conference that was associated with fixing the federal recognition process. In fact the the the slogan for the conference was who besides your real which is kind of different question and and that's what -- wanna talk a little bit about. This deal for the show today. I did a little bit of what what what you guys. What your conference accomplished too because it's it's related and if let's talk natives that sort of -- of a -- Now but I also wanna get into. What was discussed what. Again the candidate. Almost the competing themes that this federal recognition conference because. There was the question of who decides your real and the in the nation that -- going to -- the the first -- -- -- -- -- -- -- Was about inherent -- and that's another question and but I think it's relevant I think it's relevant to. To why you -- and seek federal recognition what federal recognition even means. You for me I'd give a crap I came out of the whole thing now going you've been coming out is that it's not just that the federal recognition process is flawed. It is it's that the federal recognition itself is flawed so you run into -- into you know a whole other a whole lot of issue a whole other problem and. And what we're talking a little bit about about what. What that was about now for those Ubisoft own the Promos that put about show my intent was also to have a great deal join us tonight but. But Greg is doing quite under the weather. And and he he really. Reluctantly bailed out with an eight. But always get well we'll have you back on I was little doesn't value you -- that I know that you started. Hacking pretty good down there -- concerned about whether you make the -- -- nine SK UN and affected your life. All and and he -- I don't need to know how that happened at that it's not that kind of show. But. But again it's all of them let you guys are all of these to join me here and and again I thought the -- there was some really really. Interesting conversation that took place not just. From the the panel standpoint but also. You know some of those those -- arson among some of the people we got here throughout the catch up with was leveled -- -- -- -- and you know. When I spoke to the crowd I guided and got it to address a little bit of that -- street when we we often together. Regardless of whether. The ship -- you know photographer -- federally recognized -- not we stood together. Against the state on the tax battle back and in the nineties. Specifically during the tech the tech industry. And the power that was there I also didn't even put it as you can answer I have bullet but it because. I was one of the -- would was really really bothered. When. The senator present Porter. Actually he started even before it was pathetic president. Started trying to to launch a campaign against. Against interacting with it would not federally recognized tribes specifically he had issues with. With the tobacco treated as a related to what you know how it transpired in. You know a Long Island and what that what that uses like. And so he. Instituted a policy. -- I think the policy advisor and and tried to outlaw essentially. And prohibit Seneca businesses from from conducting commerce. With not better that that tries specifically although he did mention it this was geared towards the those of both -- and I know that the folks down. On Long Island were offended but there were plenty of people around here that were open and obviously there were businesses that still. Frankly continue to do do business with the anyway but. It it's evidence of the of the problems that we have not just with the with the with the recognition process -- how we as native people. I have have weighty enough on the eighty Hewitt and and I think the one of the guys who opened up the conference with. With prime clad SP who was the president of the and the AI. He talked about the competition for resources and it's -- -- that this company's resources it's competition or. For gaming market there's all kinds of other things to come and play. That pit us against each other Jack Abramoff is it was a classic example a guy who you'll worked as well as a lobbyist or for gaming tribes and spend more time repeating one try to get together. While he's getting paid from multiple sources. And that there's so much controversy it's corruption associated with mood many aspects of this. And and we're talking about a lot of that stuff that that's today. I didn't have the opportunity beyond our panel with frank. -- who is. It's pretty well. Pretty well known he's he's been involved in in even of the recognition process for a zone. Personal people he was they. The little Trevor and of dollar. Call. And as we also led to attack -- was an attorney who represented. Various tribes who accused process but -- -- another work in any country. And John Norwood who is. These low enough they he's a nothing pastor you kissed it and an apartment over the retired. Go to my. Mighty FaceBook group page look for the links to the the video this this team that was webcast. And and the Bentley that was for the webcast is now the league for the for the video. It it's interesting and and it's worth taking but didn't look at obviously that would suggest the -- to. One hour 27 minutes for a start but. But you get up and well be used to listen at all that is. It there's a lot to take it there's actually two days there's there's two separate links. But. I think there were some effective things that he and in the lead into this thing -- -- not always the most of -- with these -- and -- -- -- -- there -- things -- -- -- That'd -- that I agree with you know there's there's this whole sense of you know we -- time. We'll hear people talk about while you're not -- nation your -- corporation follows them and and and I know a lot of people who. I'm getting to that. That language that's that -- semantics but but let's be clear -- Amy no. They they said it would no hesitation. That to be federally recognized but he could be recognized by the security Indian affairs means that you subordinate to that it is and in fact. Build their language suggests that to be recognized means that -- under their jurisdiction. That's what it means I mean you are recognize that tried Gator Nation of Indians supported the laws and -- the United States so. And and and everybody goes into that. -- that expectation that knowledge but I think we we need to know that that's the perspective they have because. When we're fighting these issues so of sovereignty and jurisdiction. And and defend yourself not only get the statement at the federal government. We're not even having that conversation when it -- I think look. I don't care how you define what federal recognition news we need it. I mean I think that there are the I don't know. I mean I don't know what the but the current president Seneca nation with suggest you know or there or their attorneys. But I think that's a hard pill for the basic -- of people that'd be here. -- their own elected officials or their own hired guns in terms of their -- say. Now you're there you know you're there. And if that's if -- that matter of fact in an idol rock -- worked together or not I don't know that -- you're. You -- interpretation of it but how do you how do you not challenged at some point. It's it's not it's not my interpretation but I I've been wrong long enough to hear it -- come -- Seneca -- And most of it was you know back in the sixties and early seventies. It took us a while but we know from that. You know that kind of understanding and but that's what they were basically saying well you know earlier or. You know -- -- and there's phone. You know all those declarations that listen you know you're under jurisdiction. You know federal government. And are for -- with pro life. Rilya. Strong well opposition to our position is -- turnovers and commission that I can remember room. Others. More subversive but you can tell that most attorneys. Because the way that they had read that document felt editors wrote their reading interpretations. Of the federal government so. You can almost almost hear them in the background. You know that you can I think this way about. The losses was in the problem with. -- where you position. Legal counsel in Europe overall nation's strategy you know things that I do here and I know regularly who recchi represents. River prizes and WS. The ones who response from them immigrants cigarettes. He came to a -- retreat meeting once and on and everybody was really anxious for what he had to say that they know that you know this brand has been successful -- -- figured that this then there must be. Very -- while we're well represented by by legal compliment of asking him about questions and then look. My job easy to defend your sovereignty. He's my job is defying the laws in the laws that they're trying to use against you. And and and find how they are inappropriately using I've you know I'm I'm a lot of water my job is to defend. The US constitution and in US lost a lot of and but where my role fits with the -- east east Tuesday. You are missed applying state law you missed applying federal law. In his NBA and there gonna go to throughout. History. -- and he says that's -- that's my job news you wanna know about about. Insolvent in and that's what he's -- that I could point to me in the room. Give him that he does he know more about that and that I do an end. And and I was glad I was saying I would -- with prop me up but the point was. That's the same thing for the lawyers that that the nation -- they're they're only jobs are not to be. The arbitrators or the the value leaders of our sovereignty there only job back I don't care what their opinions are their only job community should be because if there. If they're lawyer's license to practice the Lawton in the federal system in the state system. Do your jobs are defying the flaws in their loss and how they're -- supplying and and I think that that is something that there -- people don't and that we're gonna have a lawyer is going to be kind of -- But that position. Let was breaking news this person whoever courier receive an added to -- that was that was. Nice and honest to have some say that truck and because. Well I come from a oddly like on the jurisdictional battles and and I said before the show but times as the look. My question isn't did you pass a law that says they get that you have jurisdiction my question is indeed. Did you pass laws that says. That we are US citizens my question isn't it. Data court rule -- in this case that you know in in eighteen point three does that that are jurisdiction had had diminished Mike my question is. When did happen how did it happen how does -- have. How does that have any legal recognition because you can adjudicate our sovereignty away and you can't legislate away the only appeared tired you're your own declaration of independence says. That a just government you know if that it comes from the the consent of the governed. So where does that does that come from when it went everything okay where you are now and it didn't matter if the lawyers that. It doesn't matter of lawyers and -- yeah -- you're under the jurisdiction but frankly. The first ambler tell me that as the as the time there with relevant if it if that's your view and -- gonna actually stayed at my faith but that I don't need. I think we need to have a whole lot of conversation and an I started they're -- bring a little of that conversation. -- is this conference likely. I was surprised that I was asked to speak at this conference I don't feeding on you when I look at these these things -- -- throw open. That is beer in. I mean so anyway -- and don't usually when I look at some of the names on this stuff I mean now. You know a friend and Weaver Greg Richardson and I look at all of these these names that that people know throughout the country is as being authorities Aniston authorities and that. They -- a guy who does radio. And they fronted activists who does radio and exactly -- I was -- I was on the pro what what I thought was one of the premier handle the puck when he heard the poverty and they -- exactly happened. And I was glad to do so I mean. I don't know. I don't know you if you get any ovation that these things but. -- the hit I thought that was got a got a cool but. An and I know that I planted at some seats and I think. When you go to something like this you know the intent is to use to create. A dialogue and picking -- in the process and we'll talk a little bit about. Some of the flaws than on in that process along but today it's quarter after submitting a break again -- -- get -- Dartmouth College honor roster out of -- studio this let's talk -- over it. Your -- -- -- a proud sponsor of let's talk -- with John McCain's -- to visit your poison gas and -- but on the -- territory of the Seneca nation on the corner center and broad streets in the city of Salamanca. You're -- -- goes sells discounted tobacco products and convenience items can provide full service gas. For a quick -- from the southern tier stuff that iroquois gas and go open from 6 AM till 10 PM every day. George shortstop for saving his iroquois gas -- -- For the best prices in your favorite tobacco products and more gets Mikey he's emporium in orbit. Save on a huge selection of Lucas she -- cigar wraps rolling papers accessories. Detox lines and the lowest prices on tobacco products allowed. From Buffalo, New York in the historic homeland of the Seneca. Let's talk native rides on the power of ESPN 1520 powerhouse -- often down on the East Coast of turtle island. Join the discussion on let's start -- -- your host John McCain. All right they've gone back to John Candy I'm. What I would do a couple of my my shot out some things this is paid programming so it only exists when when people contribute in and support the show. Obviously I have some advertisers. I'm not enough but I have some advertisers but I also have a few people who who make significant donations. Especially when it when Myers and welcome to. And I wanted to go to movies some of those people pat and that broad street tobacco. Joseph Carter beat down on wholesale the folks over cap reds. I was you -- you support the show in you know your wife and as I appreciate appreciate that. I'm double spring. His daughter Nikki and and or they both to step up and -- the -- and in big ways. My good friend is still that makes contributions as well some of the other listeners Janis Siegel and some dangerous. I've got you know a fair number of people that that that step up from time to time. Obviously advertisers. Mike he's emporium. Ortiz walked up on -- These are these are people that that make this possible I also -- got a a fairly nice contribution in the last. In the last quarter from the Mohawk -- commerce so it was great to get some support from from another communities well -- You know I know what we're doing here had an impact. From. Sometimes that comes it comes back to me in the form of rumor could -- -- sometimes. You know you did you get the phone calls and you and you find out that that somebody's that -- you know really put a bug it's a real. Years and stuff as as -- that are going to discuss this conference for instance. You know I know that this conference was -- geared towards fixing the -- recognition process and for those that don't know. You know. This and I and have frankly I didn't notice I always thought that the federal recognition process. Was about. Getting those tribes that were terminated during the termination hero of of the US policy. Getting them back recognized but Judy Shapiro was actually invited to the proper she said documentary by congress has tried. You can go through this process. The only way you can get recognized you were terminated by congress is to make it make it appealed to congress you need to have a congressional act that if you back. -- which is bizarre to me so. Up apparently what this recognition process is ease. -- geared more towards. I guess establishing something that that the federal government claims never existed before that it that the federal government never existed there are recognized. This is that. And of course even the load of crap I mean. You know some of these these. These nations these peoples have treaties and they don't have treaties they have relationship with the -- with the state governments they wrote relatives all with each other and yet. You have this you have hundreds. It at least a 150 but there that probably more than that I've heard of at least a 150. Native peoples who have. Oh over hundred begun the process but in thirty years. Only seventeen. I think -- back in forty years only seventeen. Native -- native peoples have been -- No tolerance for Euro all -- I think only to -- audio to analyze and Angela and the last two. Took over thirty years. And the costs associated and and as a mention in the first segment Lance comes it was a it is a friend of ours -- that we we stood side by side with analog tax that you. You know Lance. He remembered and used twelve years old one is though when he's people first and file footage and adding -- the afternoon filed a petition. What happened was bit by the land claims and because they'd done that the federal government to -- (%expletive) vapors put them on the list. Sony actually. Put him in the process as if they had petition and and they continued as time went on continued but the thing and it cost them 33 million dollars. 33 million dollars to get federally recognized. And then. They are recognized. Which -- with a with a with a gaping hole in what they're better recognition it became public this. There's a ruling that that yet we recognize you as the tribe. Nation her band of -- support -- cup the United States. But we only recognize you as the having existed since 1934. While and of course what we had the same question I know we talked amongst coupled with the treatment of the 1934. Well what happened in 1934 was the what they call the Indian reorganization act and that's where they tried to essentially wipe out traditional the whole intention of the Indian reorganization act. Was to say. Where -- we don't want recognize. Traditional government we don't want recognized constitutional notes that in a different story at a constitutional. You guys that. Move to a good constitutional government and 1840s or something along those lines. And but -- so you guys didn't restructures itself as a part of a as a federal act but in 1934 that was the effort it would if they were providing funds are kind of inducements for people there to do the things but as a part of that. And and and that one of these and talk about this conference was that. The reason this Indian reorganization act happened in 1934 was because. Finally the federal government got the placement within look. -- -- wipe out anymore these guys that we've gotten me do it anymore so this is -- Which you live tomorrow. Bull will allow them to exist. Although we're gonna still assimilate and to some extent met with the whole thing was so it. If it had some people regarded this thing as this huge concession or this huge about face and federal policy but had a tremendously negative side especially since. There there was of this list. Unit in the nineteen in 1920 or even -- or any of that time that said here are all the native peoples that there are. There were some lists and or some you know relationship. The it was shaping up for those of us in New York. -- are terrorism in the State of New York. It was very very little -- Europe and in -- involvement and that was kind of came out really in the in the ever report from 1920s. How the federal government. Was such a mess with how they were dealing with native people the last thing we want to do with -- was to get involved with what they called New York pride -- -- why so. But they went the I think the significant about the 1934 thing is they said. According to the recognition process if you get recognized only back and it is it 34 what that means is that. You you can't get away and placed in trust for so. If you're are trying to -- recapture or reclaim some of your loss plans. There you are. Prohibited from having that angle from feet he did in the federal trust that's not something where that for -- with -- Arlene at the wrong held. -- held by yes we we all our lands our our our nation's -- and are people who own land. But from from most most these territories have gotten federally recognized unless they can. They they managed to get that recognition that predates. You know 1934. They can't expand their land base and so you have this crazy circumstance where we're at. The process not only takes thirty to thirty years or forty years or whatever. It he has this tremendous costs associated with the you have to hire professionals. And and every time -- they hit you with something that you're you're short on you've got to spend. You know. For lawyers and I anthropologists. And acknowledges. And you know I hit historians -- all these people see and and if you try yourself. He just that bill because there's there's somebody that's gonna -- YouTube -- I have three white people who sit there and and judge whether you're with your regular -- So it it turns into this you know tens of millions of dollars. So how would anybody for tens of new dollars especially interest there. Well and what happens is that you will cartel along -- what does should. One the end what they had to do is they they actually made a deal. With with -- developers and look. We think we can get through this process now. Let us -- edition -- -- not begin this process with any I had gaming they had no intention of pursuing gaming. They were trying to secure the land -- it started out as more ball laying claim -- issue that anything. And that's where they start out front but then they get to a place where it will where they got so much money invest -- That they that they have no choice but to pursue it so when and and what they enemy you deal with it with a game developer. To front them the money. Two to go through the process -- obviously some some promise that they would allow that developer to. To build a gaming facility for himself. Gaming becomes as I said in my eight and you know -- -- the -- pound rule in the rule. And not just because people are. Got into the process for that but on Whitney compete for the process used to you know an -- again make it make a deal for game. And and of course that that's that's where money can come to get you through the process or what it also becomes the horrible process because you have. Other gaming -- the EC is rotten and in Michigan in and was confident -- places California. Where if you're RO are already recognize and you already have a -- facility. You don't want somebody within two -- two listener Q did you recognize it putting him -- now almost like you're gonna lose marketshare so you exceed its native against native. I mean it is so beyond that -- pour stuff. You -- this whole a whole other level of the federally recognized. Tribes against the non federally recognized for. That -- Allen who is the same thing look. -- myself said he wanted to break out sessions you know colors and -- You know after sitting in there and going through the first day. You know we're we're we're on -- panel like everybody else well you know how we -- we look at it fix it pill clause one -- applause. The main thing that nobody really wanted to talk about is that this is meant for you. Is if the truth stores where you in fact all other state against you. 33 million dollars. 3040 years that you've got to hang in there and what you're gonna do it is that you'll be reckoned nice. -- you don't have the ability. -- and and not to mention the fact that. In order due to configure yourself to get through the process you already have to go through at another level assimilation -- can look and feel and smell right for them. To a to a preview. And -- and that's to me. This wasn't just about -- the recognition process being a flawed it's it's the recognition itself and and it's the jurisdictional issue it's the whole subordinate the laws and customs the United States issue. But it's more than that. It is and I knew I was in a separate program from you and I think you know at some point. So long line we ought to be elusive. You know the harsh words this is genocide this is a continuation. Of a policy of the United States to eliminate us as -- people that -- that's exactly what we were one of the issues. What that went through a ladies from a think Louisiana brought up was the typical things that there was difficulty and assistance with housing in in with education but one of the other. Paul points that she made was difficulty and that made it difficult for their voting rights. And had we had since we started the conversational. Saying well why do you wanna be voting in their elections anyway. Mean granted he -- it a gun to this point about as soon as you. Your babies born the first thing you do before you leave the hospital as they -- -- that Social Security number there was a time. You know it whether you know babies were born at home and -- you probably made a choice for the you're -- register or not but -- You wonder if we didn't we didn't get a Social Security number two we're like. Twelve or thirteen your right of the right here on the but now you're right it's it's a lot -- the possibility. That's I said you know they wanna be able to identify you write that data you're born. And so we started to make this point to say do you really want to become in considered a US citizen because we don't. And if it got a little uncomfortable it was almost like wow we don't want to talk about it let's talk about some other things here -- -- -- reality really -- -- what did you think they're struggling with that of voting conversations fact that. You know related -- it had kind of call for -- but. They're saying you know and we've been trying to do this for you know for sixty years and we used to there used to be provision. There voting registration where you had a fundraiser for me over other -- -- -- exit. It doesn't anymore. You know -- so they said the -- taken right that's was some reason also that we weird question but. Always right they. People really -- wanna. Well that's why when I when I opened up with -- -- besides I talked about the fact that we -- open. In the US constitution replaces Indian government and and I use the word Indians for the purpose of the cuts through it says. The first place -- exactly that says no we're not part of them it says that. That they will not there will not be. Representational portion to Indians not taxed it referred was of Indians not taxed more a part of the system and they -- didn't include us they didn't want us to even have representation. And and I said you know -- half jokingly but but really serious. I'm okay -- that I don't want them to represent the united. And that's where so many people that the assimilation. Has it been sold -- so deeply entrenched. Video and it's it's political it's religious and we'll talk about that a little Liz -- was on because that was and I think that that struck me in this thing. Was with the emphasis on. Christian prayer through this that this process armed with how I was actually uncomfortable but. We'll we'll talk with a look at that Bob there with a break here but that's not what we need in this I think this is a valid conversation because. We're talking a little how much impact us being there and folks like alcoholic from a night it was constant. Lance comes from you know from Long Island how much the influence from not just -- -- -- but from those of us who. Who understand things a little bit different than the rest of the country how much impact we had there. -- in recent conversation mobile will talk about the back is John McCain is the apartment we're back. Let's talk native -- John King is produced every week in association with iroquois promotions. You're -- boy promotions is a native company located on the catalog is territory of the Seneca nation. You're a boy promotions brings a combined fifteen years of emotional experience in professional and amateur sporting event and entertainment. Here boy promotions provides prominent native speakers for lectures cultural events media and educational institutions. Pass defense include professional boxing. Fantasy football events tournaments athlete showcase that more. 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OJ's has a wide variety of tax free tobacco products plus roll your own supplies tubes papers smoke -- candles and special request products like -- close premium cigars and more blue -- smoking gas now with Seneca nation fishing licenses and accessories. Open every day for eight to late at 2111 west perimeter road steamer on the beautiful Allegheny territory of the Seneca nation. Call 71635. Fours 64354. OJ smoking gas. -- Thanks for coming back to stop me. A phone line is open for it was 7168031520. Years let's talk native post John -- All right they stormed back -- done gain on in studio with Matt hill -- -- colleague John -- on its view it well. Holly Graf and I just came back from a from Phoenix we gotta -- the city and with the conference. Associated -- -- the federal recognition process. And that was some. -- It was it was -- it because we have a different. Almost probably different if frankly even though in the hall Hartley and it's different there's so much. That when we go there as as -- the -- -- but but he didn't you know a bill Bolick from a from a night it was constant. You know he. He talked about the emphasis of even you know the formation of the confederacy and the -- in our goal -- and on the we've done. It's on the things that are inner -- culture not just about seven generations but about. About what the temperament that it takes to be. In in a position. We say of service but other quality in positions of leadership issue and alcohol and other at Oklahoma did it that we had but. It was clear that even people who talked about that talked about the you know the willingness to fight with back I mean it was recognized throughout the conference. You know even date to there was it was a couple references so that it was clear that when. When we show up in the room. That. There is -- a certain assumptions about who we are. And about the position we're gonna -- at the regret -- that I just -- the primary concern that these are looking for is that just for the funding for. Here in. Exit the government dollars well it is part of that but there's also access I mean and there's a whole lot of things that you can't even begin to do. Our -- cut it if it is this obstacle Salt Lake inferences is an issue. You know so any any of the the regulatory advantages that we we fight for our territories. It becomes increasingly difficult for those places that don't have very you and I think it's it's a problem obviously. I mean I -- what we we took the dog back. -- mean we we await a court we're good they're just take it back that we ultimately I'm definitely without traffic is. What what. It's their turn to shorter identity if it really -- there's -- -- -- may not be recognized I mean not even just through legal terms but. The guy that a -- I'm playing well and and and you know that's when they recognize that got talked about news conference and and and even the folks who were talking with a processes look if you don't get through this process it doesn't mean it or not who you are yet but what what got emphasized over -- -- is that. What it means as it relates -- for the federal government there. And why that I agree that a couple of levels and I made it very clear that a I'm not federally recognized I'm I'm I'm walk I'm going to -- I'm not support the law because of the United States than and you'll never see the good -- Chicago. Make that application you'll never say we just -- his is recognized but the but the more people the the bit but it. There's no. There were not -- federally recognized them. And so having had that conversation. -- eight meet people think because I mean everybody knows well who are writing those walks are the ones I could possibly be that they that they're not recognized though. And and and the point is that that. I went there with the attitude is -- OK now being recognized because of what recognition is but that's that's still really really tough pill for a lot of these votes that's -- -- Look at Pittsburgh so very that sharp interest. You know there was enough time to really twelve. I probably as a dock and then when the QA session ended -- started. Every question was either directed towards me or -- -- hijacked or hijacked and I don't like I asked that Jack -- about about cases that. Related to this thing united and that it Jack who listed a few in general is that this. Why don't look at three -- I mean -- viewed at eight men's golf full from a long house. Nothing to do with federal recognition in that -- That goes and opens up a class who -- facility gets charged in federal court and it gets acquitted. And so I -- I've brought that up. And it was great you know I did have the opportunity to bring up. The rob Porter stuff I got a chance to bring up. To me what is the worst example of not a federal recognition of a pride so to speak under the worst example that recognition. A who was the leader of that of that drive and that's that's the right keys would agree all -- and hold them off to the came out of the the the ladies early ninety's that that resulted in in him getting federal recognition with the help of Alibaba. And then ultimately -- trying to say. No we don't recognize him anymore and then aided -- pulling his recognition -- back Jack -- was on the panel with me. He was actually a lawyer involved in the process that was trying to to have moved. And so that's why do you see -- if you watch the video as I've mentioned the that the of Oneida Indian Nation of New York. You'll see Jack neutral to buy -- these figures and up and down and he spoke with the afterwards those -- it was pretty significant. But I have a call -- so Leo let me go to weary from non north -- that -- -- -- undermine. Good evening are you gonna. That's that's one -- give your opinion and a couple of items that were in the news recently. Not side track for the conversation tonight. That's okay we're all over the place. -- well. About them in you know and -- you know actually certainly deacon in the union. Which you feel. The first on I want -- up was via. This morning's news there was. About ESPN consider green and Redskins -- -- brought cast. But they decided not to do it the controversy. With which you know. You know they -- we have controversy is their views and you know. -- I didn't want to keep your thoughts on. Recently Donald Trump is. Upstream to possibly run for -- York in how you feel that that is. Well it's the natives. Would be in the animal Vietnam and an interest in casinos in Atlantic City. -- and there are adamantly like figure in. Com as you know that are old order for our Lotto. Week in and week out continuously spew racism and hatred against Davis. And you can be done about that he and his platform that he allows people to dispute out of this again and have these racist attitudes. And you read it you'd get angry but you know just find it frustrating that. It's allowed to happen and then you know people that read I read only because I want to -- -- be informed on what you're sane. Distinct goal. You know it's just going to be. And hatred against the the -- because in the casino and and -- you know in general. -- what they want that -- because I won't spend a whole lot off Franken and you moron. I think it's it's good to know your enemy and and I think of being aware of some other the venomous stuff that the guys who writes. Is one thing. But obviously I don't I don't advocate anybody reading that regular newspaper. And I guess that. They hit the hypocrisy of that gentleman he actually met with me in the back Rossi Ross met you know we were all together. Frank -- -- literally had dinner dinner with us before one of -- shows because. He's attitude was he wanted to Seneca nation to take over the entire city of of Niagara Falls so. That's the attitude this -- so he writes all this stuff about you about. The Niagara Falls living under apartheid to the to the -- us. It is just a load of crap I mean this guy is the biggest hypocrite not always there is you were -- And he's not ignorant because you know what -- most racism is is born out of ignorance this is a guy who's just hateful and you know -- an I don't know what he expects to accomplish and maybe thinks he's just being. You know shocking in in the media and and yet he thinks that has some value but -- but as far as I'm concerned. The guy is a moron and and nobody. And gave anybody an an act save anybody winds himself up with with that sentiment. Well I I hope date they have enough courage not to not to do it anonymous. I'm over conversation what it really came down it is effective it used to prostitute themselves to us. Newspaper and basically he was looking for summary. That would sponsor all of these endeavors in order for us to do that. So he was looking for -- for dollars. And we're willing to today he was willing to prostitute yeah. He wanted to pay him to be our media the guru to help us promote this whole thing I mean that's that's what you got Frankfurt are a lot of -- by anybody. Don't think the guys seriously is more okay quickly to get together to -- You know I think the sporting news and and a couple of others and publications have taken the attitude I know. Some of the like the Washington Post and and a few other. On news publication that said they won't use the word redskin anymore in a rocket though no opportunity to watch a football franchise. So the fact that ESPN. Has even entertain that. That Procter and it's interesting you know I am and I talked about that the mascot issue on the show. I don't make it a primary focus of my attention because I think we're only gonna talk about. Eat at the name and not talk about the underlying racism that I mean let's face it that the the football team in the the United States capitol. He's called a derogatory name for native people and governor how much does it while we don't mean it to be. You know if it's insane you know to suggest that. Steve if all of the the racial -- to -- associate -- black people -- Jewish people Mexicans with. Eight with anybody. It is inappropriate Asians then how is it that you could possibly use. Again it's the -- it I don't alters -- is it more derogatory word and it doesn't matter if if admit -- I need a person that uses that -- from time -- time same thing with the one black -- will use the N word precipitous take -- -- is no offense yeah an offense he had a -- a Redskins and Laura line is at the end an offense right. I mean it's if it's absurd. You know I'll keep talking about the the issue only because it it it does relate to the the policies of the United States that are -- and racism but I do not talk about. Just the the mascot issue or the teeny issue without bringing it full circle to. You have to what it means socially to children what it means I mean let's face yet -- -- high school football teams went banners there was three of them that meet I mean national news that put banners saying yeah you're ready for another trailer tears because they're playing against teams call the Indians. He got that moron from the Philadelphia -- Who once the ball off flyers game and get the block Blackhawks and goes to a Redskins game witty. Within Indian head with a -- and I knifed him to decide they had Andy and he gets on television so what does this say about the the the network that put this guy and on the across the guys floor of the dead Indian the Indian -- the appealed. Decapitate its head it's at Redskins get skewed and so you had these sporting venues to actually let this guy in the building with this. I mean it's so there's there's a whole layer of racism and it goes beyond just the -- appropriate interpretation of a main part of electro. I don't know now but yeah it rightly. You know editor Cuomo is an -- is enough -- tool for us already as far as I'm concerned I mean. Here's a guy who ran on platform that never even including gaming. And then once he got elected. All of a sudden took all these gaming dollars -- and probably some from trump. You know good two to push for a for your state team to get in the gaming business. And you know as far as -- -- from both those guys that. He's never really showed it at shown any skill he's got a showman but I mean you could -- just the circus cup car he got that I mean -- opera that conflict of interest that. Well yeah it became governor. But you know what it again when call Murray and he said he was gonna have transparency in government there gonna change all kinds of things oh so government will be will be less that -- He bailed on the panel think that women's rights got pushed to the back instead what -- you push through he -- -- not through a gun control law. He. An -- pushed through game. In the meantime. Some of the real issues that need to be addressed -- the environmental issues associate with Hydro -- -- -- -- again that. That the real issues associated with with women's rights doctor not to support Hillary is that people -- -- yet that this people popular boating or four. I mean did you put through a the gay rights. Marriage issue and got a lot of support for that but you know everything else -- you know and and I think people kind of anticipate that that was this. What's more dangerous to. You know governor that -- our office you know underneath some of life you are or something that you know what you -- so -- you kind of know. Yeah kind of a clone and it -- -- And -- for you from from our employees like -- -- with -- about the President's Day you know I know people got it will be wild specimens back we'll talk about that a little bit about the conference down in. In in Phoenix. The -- the United States they -- -- position against the people into the matter how flowery their conversation and all the promises they make. We still used to ward when that the guy is to a to describe the president United States the governor is like a little one of the guys there there's there you got a guy who. And frankly discovered the current governor sitting there is steel pushing issues trying to beat us up over tax issues were still. In the throes of battles over over over tobacco and sales taxes excise tax and all that stuff. Yeah he got the money freed up to him from from the united is in from the mohawks and nine and from the senate -- on gaming and he got his game again. But I don't know that we're gonna be any worse offering better off with you know. -- with would drop in there Villanova help thing but but I got a good break Larry thanks for the call and and not keep me up gives -- the post on some of our a lot of stuff because I don't want to read that paper and more than half duplicate news that the anyway this decade does not -- quarterback. Cubicle. If you took the time to stop and say that the your quick smoke shop on the counter August territory of the Seneca nation right near the Wanda -- -- 438. -- -- record smoke shop is a full service convenience store and gas station. Providing discount tobacco products gas diesel and propane. To convenience stores open from 6 AM to 10 PM daily but the gas pumps and pump house are open 24 hours seven days a week. The record smoke shop -- -- support so let's talk native with John King show on KV fifteen to one size does matter the policing their tobacco accessory shop proves it with the largest selection of unique to. -- items and hand blown glass pieces of Western New York. From the last two wood to metal they've got all the finest pipes as well as who gets tapestries. Wild very incense sticks nag -- cents incense candles and so much more did he get the naughty side of the please bear with great bachelorette party gift some more. The pleasing their tobacco accessory shop in the building formerly known as -- racing. Behind the red smoke shop on Bloomingdale's in the tunnel on to -- territory. -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- From Buffalo, New York in the historic homeland of the Seneca. Let's talk negative rides on the power of ESPN 1520 powerhouse single up and down on the East Coast of turtle island. Join the discussion on let's talk native with your host John McCain. I'm nick Novak is John McCain is -- native. You know. Just because we're we're kind of winding down the hour here before we go to break but I wanted to mention. As I suggested there was an awful lot of all Obama's been of the president's fourth and set down there. Not everybody shares that sentiment in fact when we're in the summer break out sessions and I know I talked to wanna be with no I don't -- that but. That Brian. That is the end and others. Other view on various panels kept saying look there's a deadline we gotta get this that this that recognition process fixed. Now before the end of this this administration because. This may be -- -- shot and and -- and the problem how how great this administration as well. I I obviously don't share that that sentiment in an -- -- -- is spoke at the beginning of this thing and again I encourage you go to my FaceBook group page. -- for via the link to the Arizona State University. Webcast and and video and you can -- checking out for yourself and there's a there's a lot there but. You know my my -- the first full panel that was there and I there was some good stuff that there's it. It's worth take a look at but. But I talked to our talk -- the whole lot of the guys think but I also -- Rahal bomber killed 3000 jobs. In one of my break out session that we had federal agents reading. Forced mrs. -- separate territories duck during the Obama administration we never saw that wouldn't see that way Republican let alone many Democrats. As this'll be lot of talk about how great Obama has spent and how -- even qualify that yeah -- he does once. Once a year yes you know 500 and native leaders show up to. -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- Now Michelle Volvo healthy. But but I mean I thought I have some I have some real problems with. You know of course the whole sequestration things you know comes in though there have been -- cut out of stuff and you know and Andy spent again at some piece of legislation in the -- -- violence against women's act. You know he did this last thing -- and I am not do moron on this as time goes on but. He did this promise owns the only thing missing Ross stated they jump. He initiated it was just last week that nobody even knew about it and I talked in some of the guys that was not this conference so they know in the about the promise them what a promise zones what and he's. It's like five of them. And at the pilot program and it didn't involves tax incentives and the power and promise program. Was -- for an area in Los Angeles one on one for an area of Chicago want for area Philadelphia and one for an area Kentucky. And the choctaws of all of Oklahoma. And and you frankly that does aren't even the most you know destitute territory and in Indian Country I mean there's there's they're. They're relics of more affluent than most. But the point is. Rather making another promise -- your promise on public even the old ones I mean we we we do have some major issues with. Went with it involves some battles over taxes are brought up the before tax issue you to a crowd of people who probably had no idea what I was talking about. And even if they were a factor but it in knowing about it and I talked about how this administration. Quietly sat back. While the tax. While while the floor taxing was imposed upon interpret and and it's not like it's -- Unknown to them obviously roster when I went and met with Jodi Gillette we spent hours talking tour. And and in the long and the short it was Houston out. You know we kind of got beat up over that law higher resting associated with the of the Internal Revenue Service. Denying. Not nonprofits that is who is it to all the Tea Party applicants. So were little skittish about the evolving policies will -- -- he's not being involved in policy you have an executive order from. From several presidents and no one has been reaffirmed by this president of the says. Any agency ordered. Or it. Expect our executive agency administration. That develop the policy. There has tribal implications. He's supposed to do -- only with coupled with the with collaboration and consultation with the with so called tribal leaders as it that didn't get done here in fact. It's quite the opposite I talk -- ball you know Gillibrand opposite the senator and Higgins opposite congressman. And -- both confirmed. That and he had no idea that. Was going to be used to -- you you have to from a special interests that it's been involved in politics overstate why are there or federal government involved. You know from the bureaucracies that are developed through the Bureau of Indian Affairs that. I don't know hog ever gonna get rid of those guys could have a pretty strong special interest group there. This whole lot of dollars and people are siphoning money out of it for other programs that the right. But then you had -- business of other in the politics of other of governors -- special interest big business. That we have to deal with and that's really what your view when that's why doesn't make a difference who's elected here who's elected. And as long -- the attitude is of the federal government or state government that. Now we can do whatever I want them could also movie they'll they'll try it did not take us to court and will win -- and when when the federal government you and I again Ross you and I we're Washington. During those consultations. On revisiting the UN drip. And they flat out said. Our current remedy. For conflict -- native people is our court system and so how does that work how -- your -- system beat that and -- remedy is that we weekend. Exactly and how how can our sovereignty. TE vision. Adjudicated in a court that is bound by their own constitution of our sovereignty just outside of their constitution they can't even have that conversation and yet. As I bring this stuff up even indie bands like -- like this this week. You can see some blanks there's an awful lot of faces I don't think people in every even considered this thing so. And and I and so when Jimmy Shapiro invites -- to think she knew I was gonna say some is that he knows that. This is kind of groundbreaking for anybody in here and now I'm not saying she buys and everything that I'm saying but she at least thought it was important summary here. And that's the conversation. Again you know Matt -- and I've talked about planting seeds I mean. We weren't so we know we're not gonna change things overnight when people ask me and asked that it be on the -- before. When people ask me. How do you stay. Energized about doing this -- possibly go look for your small successes you know look for those little small victories because we're not gonna change things overnight but you know when I get calls on the phone and and I see people being around who who you heard me -- heard my show. Or maybe picked up on a column that everything in the -- times -- the only -- who wrote that because I thought that but I never knew how to save before. And and that's that's that encourages me. Then they may think one -- but that your voices -- -- coroner had. Now there remember what you said -- -- -- -- but the dollar. Carrier. -- process unfolds off putting some people's minds of these I'll give you an example no value -- your friends. -- suggested that she was thinking about. Getting river. Her Seneca nation IP and and and I've heard others who talk about. You know getting -- and cars than me a burning as a security guards not having a driver let them anymore and and and and it and my advice to her was look those are the things that -- -- -- the same thing about the conference federal recognition isn't gonna define new. We need to because we redefine ourselves we need to decide who we are. Ourselves. And and at the end of the day nobody else it doesn't matter summary. Throws that dog tag on us and in the example I used or use user cal it was a if you put that dog tag along with -- You know saw an. But at the same time. We do have to start to walk you walk the walk and talk the talk a little bit we gotta we gotta be a little bit more assertive about who we are and and I planted some seeds there are no real rusty UN and Lance and you know again bill moment but there -- other people heard from the stuff and frankly the guy who spoke before -- John John Harwood he was hit some good positive things to talk about GD colonizing the mine tonight. And I built upon some of the stuff he says as well. I -- and I hear you say these things. And their lofty. But you know we practice those things and the difference between being. Seneca Mohawk -- some of these others other folks -- that we actually do this so we assert there you -- gonna stand line we're gonna we're gonna fight back and and I think people need to realize that the more we stand with the each -- stronger we are and and we don't necessarily have to have everything people just about our relations with the federal government that we need to comes through more while focusing on each other. But we're gonna dig up and take a break him back for our two we got more cover on this stuff and we because it was it was a two day conference after all and -- And we'll we'll we'll get into some some other interesting. Aspects of the of the conference and -- and -- -- we're gonna get into what got one Hollywood to Phoenix for the first place where we hijacker roar so we'll. We'll be back if it is John Jane is let's not native will be right back. Buffalo's home for the number one brand in world wide sports ESPN. 15:20 AM WW.